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Tuna

Bloody Branches NPC

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MvPs are hard to hunt for new people trying to make their way into being capable in the game, and since old players and developing players need these cards to compete, they usually are the ones who are able to hunt these MvPs (and camp them) to get the cards. Bloody branches have usually been the alternative for new players, but since new players can only get bloody branches from event or log in rewards, it's not a feature that's very helpful for the striving population of the server.

My suggestion is to implement a Bloody Branch NPC which will take n amount of Dead Branches plus m amount of Blood of Wolf (#6252) and j amount of Zeny from players in order to make x amount of Bloody Branches. The option for the NPC would be as follows: 

  • 2,500 Dead Branches + 25 Blood of Wolf + 10,000,000 Zeny = 3 Bloody Branches
  • 15,000 Dead Branches + 250 Blood of Wolf + 100,000,000 Zeny = 35 Bloody Branches
  • 30,000 Dead Branches + 500 Blood of Wolf + 1,000,000,000 Zeny = 100 Bloody Branches

"WHAT THIS IS GONNA UPSET THE BALANCE OF THE FOUR KINGDOMS!!11!!shiftshift!!1!"

Now, before you get your panties in a bunch. Let's try to look at the data that can support this suggestion.

Firstly, Let's take a look at the requirements:

1. Dead Branch. Using the GatheringRO website item database, we can see which monsters drop dead branches and the rate of drop.

Spoiler

 

Screenshot_2.png.beb6fc73d14b60ee3d749d316e9c5f05.png

Let's add some more detail into this:

Screenshot_3.png.68bcdc66bd19804ece47141ba6eebcd0.png

Let's consider this data. The best chance at farming dead branches would be to hunt Enchanted Peach Tree, Elder Willows, Nine Tail and Wooden Golem. If someone were to concentrate on farming either of these mobs, we're looking at a maximum range of 70-150 Dead Branches per 60 minutes (which is inconclusive since some players are good at farming).

 

2. Blood of Wolf. Providing the same data as with earlier.
 

Spoiler

 

Screenshot_4.png.6a3413cf0545f00e0155562fd9b17e76.png

Screenshot_5.png.e988d50e4b313104f60b8ede348585e6.png Screenshot_6.png.9391896fbd37b975f66abae82c717dbd.png

 

 

POSSIBLE REACTIONS

Possible Reaction 1: "This seems too easy! Blood Branches will be easier to get and MvP cards are gonna flood the market!"

Answer: So, considering that new players wouldn't be farming alone, since they usually form groups or group with older or developing players, the process of farming would be a little faster pair this with the idea that other newbies will be farming for their own groups into the equation, then the supposed ease of this would transform into somewhat of a challenge. MvP drops are still gonna be 1%. If anything, only the 100% drops which people profit from will be affected.

Possible Reaction 2: "It isn't newbie friendly at all!"

Answer: The fact that this quest would make Bloody Branches available in a way other from the conventional methods is already friendly.

Possible Reaction 3: "Newbies/People can just go join Events / do ET to get MvP cards!"

Answer: Events usually, from what I see recently, give out costumes or headgears for prizes. No bloody branch or other form of compensation is given for consolation prize. ET has a cooldown of 1 week, and people are unable to get the MvPs they want at the higher floors due to #thelaze or just because they aren't geared enough for it.

 

CONCLUSION

This would be helpful for newbies or not, there could also be adverse effects. But then again, that's the purpose of this post. Please give your feedback and criticism. Do you think this is a good idea or a bad idea, please say why so we can work around to possibly making this suggestion a reality.

Thanks for reading~ much love,

Tuna /lv

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probably reaction no 1. thanks tuna for providing answers hahahaha. but idk, mvps seems so flooded on server. but this is nice idea. its like daily quest.

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I'm actually thinking at reaction 1 situation. If we have a high supply of cards, prices will be reduced, which is actually good for newbies and old players who just recently been active as well.

Good suggestion, Tuna. +1 to this.

10 minutes ago, LKshaye said:

probably reaction no 1. thanks tuna for providing answers hahahaha. but idk, mvps seems so flooded on server. but this is nice idea. its like daily quest.

I think the problem is, those new generation of gRO players got a hold on most MVP cards and it's up to them deciding how much they'll price it since newbies(even some old players) can't compete with them on MVP huntings. It's a clear and obvious monopoly we have here and it's really sad.

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Yeah, the main point that I'm trying to put across regarding the reaction 1 situation is that there is a limited amount of places people can go to consistently farm dead branches. This means that not everyone will be able to farm as much as they want, but they still have the chance to farm for it (no lifers are bound to sleep too!). It is still a challenge BUT unlike our current ways (waiting a tomb, OP player comes in and insta-kill) this is actually rewarding, which is such a great feeling for newbies! Doing something hard that yields a result.

 

17 minutes ago, Gelo said:

I think the problem is, those new generation of gRO players got a hold on most MVP cards and it's up to them deciding how much they'll price it since newbies(even some old players) can't compete with them on MVP huntings. It's a clear and obvious monopoly we have here and it's really sad.

Sadly this is true. It's also very difficult for newbies to question the prices set, or to trust vendors who are always free to raise the price to unsuspecting nabcakes (like myself).

 

And thanks for reading! I took the liberty of adjusting my suggested exchange equation to make it less abusable and more rewarding as the amount of things you farm increase.

 

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+1

But with some slight modifications..

REVISED EDITION:

*** 2,000 Dead Branches + 200 WoE Fragments + 200m Zeny = 3 Bloody Branches

*** 2,500 Dead Branches + 250 WoE Fragments + 250m Zeny = 7 Bloody Branches

*** 3,000 Dead Branches + 300 WoE Fragments + 300m Zeny = 15 Bloody Branches

/no1

 

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49 minutes ago, D e M o N said:

+1

But with some slight modifications..

 

*** 20,000 Dead Branches + 2000 WoE Fragments + 20 Mithril Coins = 10 Bloody Branches

*** 25,000 Dead Branches + 2500 WoE Fragments + 25 Mithril Coins = 20 Bloody Branches

*** 30,000 Dead Branches + 3000 WoE Fragments + 30 Mithril Coins = 30 Bloody Branches

 

/no1

 

You seem to overprice the part on WoE Fragments and 20 Mithril Coins? Would you like to see farmers on pub doing "S> Bloody Branches = 500m/ea"? And why the effin' would a newbie farm that much  just to get 10 PCS of Bloody Branch? The point here is to help newbies get faster and a bit easier way to farm MVPs, not to effin' make it harder. /bzz

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1 hour ago, D e M o N said:

+1

But with some slight modifications..

 

*** 20,000 Dead Branches + 2000 WoE Fragments + 20 Mithril Coins = 10 Bloody Branches

*** 25,000 Dead Branches + 2500 WoE Fragments + 25 Mithril Coins = 20 Bloody Branches

*** 30,000 Dead Branches + 3000 WoE Fragments + 30 Mithril Coins = 30 Bloody Branches

 

/no1

 

This defeats the purpose of the suggestion. It's to be newbie friendly, but that is totally not newbie friendly at all. Just the WoE fragments being at 2,000k+ should give you that idea.

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+1 Make them account bound too is good. Like daily reward haha

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@Gelo @Tuna How about this then?

 

 

*** 2,000 Dead Branches + 200 WoE Fragments + 200m Zeny = 3 Bloody Branches

*** 2,500 Dead Branches + 250 WoE Fragments + 250m Zeny = 7 Bloody Branches

*** 3,000 Dead Branches + 300 WoE Fragments + 300m Zeny = 15 Bloody Branches

 

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That's pretty much just as bad Vio.

There is indeed a large flow of MvP cards, but, as said before, they are being monopolized, and you simply cannot belive the merchants selling them. The chance of finding one that isn't overpriced, is around 1 in 100.

@Koxy some Bloody Branches are already account bound. The ones from the Daily Rewards I belive.


Some small things by the way:

-Bloody branches tend to be given to 2nd and 3rd places in events.

-They are also acquierable in the WoE Castles in the treasure rooms. (Guild Master only, but GL's normaly give them to their members)

-Invasions also have them as prizes.

-From Daily Rewards.

 

All that being said, I'm not sure about this. Although it could work, it'd have to be discussed a lot, not to mention balanced, but we'll see~

 

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what if we make goldring drop bloody branches at 0.1%? Hahaha dont take my comment seriously guys I dont want a fight hahaha

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2 hours ago, Sissney said:

That's pretty much just as bad Vio.

There is indeed a large flow of MvP cards, but, as said before, they are being monopolized, and you simply cannot belive the merchants selling them. The chance of finding one that isn't overpriced, is around 1 in 100.

@Koxy some Bloody Branches are already account bound. The ones from the Daily Rewards I belive.


Some small things by the way:

-Bloody branches tend to be given to 2nd and 3rd places in events.

-They are also acquierable in the WoE Castles in the treasure rooms. (Guild Master only, but GL's normaly give them to their members)

-Invasions also have them as prizes.

-From Daily Rewards.

 

All that being said, I'm not sure about this. Although it could work, it'd have to be discussed a lot, not to mention balanced, but we'll see~

 

If this would be implemented in our current state, there are 71 mobs in 2 different maps that guarantee 100% dead branch drop, 370 mobs in 9 different maps that guarantee 50% drop and 30 mobs in 1 map that can guarantee 25% drop. Multiple people farming would make it more difficult than it seems to be able to farm the amount you want. Ideally, people would aim for the 30,000 dead branches option because it returns the most amount compared to the others even if you repeat them enough times to get the amount of bloody branches given by the 3rd option.

How often do we have events and how often does someone win bloody branches? How often do automated events give bloody branches? What other ways aside daily rewards can a new player and developing players have a chance at getting bloody branches?

Saying that there is no need for an alternative, when people already speak out about how difficult it is to hunt MvPs, because there's an untapped resource of cards that isn't being sold is like telling thirsty people to not find ways to get water, since there's an underground water stream that can be used for a well but it's not going to be used for a well by the people who own it, so, thirst away, thirsty people!

To clarify for your concerns:

  • MvP cards are still going to drop at 1%
  • If you can't get developing people to invest into BG, what more for WoE? Plus, if the same guilds win over and over then they'd just get the bloody branches anyway. Still no chance for other players to have a go at them.
  • So far as balancing goes, if you guys want to be stingy, you can reduce the drop rate of dead branches, and make sure that no easily available mob with more than a single spawn amount drops it at 100%.

 

I asked an old player here who had stopped playing, why they had stopped playing and the person told me that there wasn't enough going on for that person to still invest time in the game. The same thing is with new people or developing people, if you're online all day trying to hunt MvPs and can't seem to get your MvPs because an old player wants to farm those cards and make zeny (which isn't bad) then you're bound to feel discouraged and just give up. People would say that they experienced the hardships themselves and were able to overcome it, so why can't new players but let's think about it, how many of the new people who joined with you actually stay? At what rate are new people staying and leaving?

We love the server! My friends and I have been jumping servers since we got back into RO a few months ago and this is the only one where we've stayed for over 2~3 weeks, and even though the rates (MvP and cards in general) and the camping (6 geared people camping Moonlight, really?) are very very very discouraging we've been trying to find alternate ways to get our cards (that's why we've been doing ET on multiple characters, but really?).

Never point out a problem without offering a solution. This is what I've always been taught in my engineering management classes, when we find a fault in a system or a flaw in a design, do not just identify, but prepare a solution. And I think that this would actually provide old and new players with more things to do, something that isn't too hard and something that isn't too easy. No matter how good your gear is, it doesn't affect the rate at which you can farm effectively.

Maybe I'll ask some volunteer players to farm dead branches for 1 hour for me, and I'll take that as a sample size to provide you with data on how much people can actually farm within 1 hour. So the data on that part of my suggestion would not become inconclusive.

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I have to admit that i don't like the idea of forcing players to farm even more than they already have to.
30k dead branches is the max amount you can even cary, and i personally (if i was a player) would not want to grind everyday the same mobs all day long.

Of course, player will have to do something to reach out to MVP cards.

But i think there are better ways to bring them to the table.

We will still throw this idea into our pot and discuss it further out.
But we will also try to find other ways to do so.


If there are any more ideas you guys may have, please let us know, we will follow this topic for sure ;)
 

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16 minutes ago, Everade said:

I have to admit that i don't like the idea of forcing players to farm even more than they already have to.
30k dead branches is the max amount you can even cary, and i personally (if i was a player) would not want to grind everyday the same mobs all day long.

Of course, player will have to do something to reach out to MVP cards.

But i think there are better ways to bring them to the table.

We will still throw this idea into our pot and discuss it further out.
But we will also try to find other ways to do so.


If there are any more ideas you guys may have, please let us know, we will follow this topic for sure ;)
 

They aren't being forced to farm anything. They can try to compete with oldies who camp MvPs, log in daily for BB's, join events for costumes BB's (like 3 BB's per event... If they even win, lol?) or farm for BB's.

As far as grinding the same mobs over and over, it does get tiring. Yet, people still farm for days on end at the Goldring field for a 30% chance of getting gold to drop so they can get some Zeny (among other things people farm for days on end, remember even normal cards are 1% drop rate, and others can kill some mobs for over 30 mins and not get anything). At least this would be more rewarding than all other methods that is currently present for players to obtain MvP cards.

I'm also curious, what better ways do you have in mind?

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This was my personal idea i've had in mind since quite some time now.
Long before the MVP Card issue become a major topic.
Please note that this is a rough idea which i haven't been working on in more detail, so take it with a grain of salt.

-----------------

The world boss mechanic (treasure chest) was never meant to be Belphegor exclusive.
Since you could go in with your friends and everyone gets a chance on a card and all the other drops.
However this requires some major balancing that the market isn't being flooded with MVP loot.

Although that system was initialy planned for Belphegor a-like events.
And this would require to rebalance every MVP since most of them get probably killed way too fast.

So i don't think changing the entire MVP mechanic of Ragnarok itself is the best aproach.

However since our automated events are pretty old already and players have been asking for more, i've had the idea of combining MVPs and automated events together. This idea could either be an extenstion to the current invasions, or replace them entirely.
It's again fighting mobs and i know there are players who would love to see something else instead.
But i think the idea of Belphegor itself is great, the players might just not be as happy if they just get an apple after a long fight.

Let's get to the main idea...


World Boss Event extension
- Featuring the official MVPs although highly enhanced in strength, health (higher difficulty)
  "Balanced" to a point that also newcomers (fully leveled up although not owning the best gear) could join in.
  Which means not as difficult to fight Belphegor, but it should take yet again quite some players to fight them.

- Fixed times and locations (or an algorithm which runs through with at least 1 event per day)
  So players know exactly at which time and where the world bosses appear so we can gather enough players to fight them.

- Similiar loot to the official MVP boss monsters.
  Which means everyone gets the chance to get their hands on a MVP card.
  We would need to take a closer look at all the drops to ensure a proper balanced economy. SInce this will increase specific exclusive MVP loot flow into the market. So some items might be more rare or we will replace or add new/other loot.

- Depending on our effort, these world boss events could be extended with a small pre-quest which would make sure that enough players are available to even summon the boss. (pre-invasion with small mobs or gather items which builds a tiny story about the event)
 If that goal is not reached, the world boss will not spawn/trigger.

This system would not replace the current MVPs, but bring additional Boss fights into the game.


Yet again, i personally think that any game is more fun while being played with friends.
Even with strangers, it's simply more fun to see a lot of others players playing with each other, and that's exactly what this system would achieve.

 

Note:
It's a rough idea in my head and doesn't mean that we will release this at all. I've not started to work on this.
I usualy have a lot of ideas and a lot of them are usualy too exotic/big while the same goal could be achieved with much less effort.

I actually did not want to release this information as it was just an idea i've had and isn't easy to be realised.
But since this is quite a big topic right now, i think it would be good to see some feedback on it.

Maybe you don't like it at all or i'm way off what you might have been looking forward to.

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I've said all I can to try and validate the suggestion, can't do anymore.

Anyway~ Thanks for reading. Just close the topic or some forum magic.

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No it's fine, as i've said.
We will still discuss your idea a long with others to find the best fitting solution to the problem ;)

My idea does not count more than any other, it's also just an idea.

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